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Topic Subject: Rebel Fleets...
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posted 01-13-07 02:02 PM EDT (US)   
Im looking for the ideal Rebel Fleets. Give me ur thoughts about what the ideal Rebel Fleet is for assaulting a fully upgraded space station, defending against a massive imperial attack, what kind of ships would best be used for assaulting pirate statinos.

May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr
Replies:
posted 01-28-07 12:56 PM EDT (US)     26 / 238  
Yes, but he was speaking of a purely MonCal vs ISD match, not including the peripheral ships.

Of course if the Corvettes are present, than VSD's, Acclamators and the rest would be as well.


"we have an agenda, a character assassination agenda, assassinating characters is what we do for a living" - Sukkit
posted 01-28-07 07:54 PM EDT (US)     27 / 238  
True MonCals do take a little beating in a pure CapShip match. But if u have the Acclamators and the VSDs and what not, then u need the Neb B Frigates, Assault Frigates, Y-Wings and all those good ass-kciking counters

May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr
posted 01-29-07 08:23 PM EDT (US)     28 / 238  
I personally enjoy playing my own customized modded game, wherein ships are more realistic to their Star Wars origins. (Can you honestly say that a fighter being hit with a turbolaser takes a negligable amount of damage? I mean hitting in the first place is hard, but then it has practically no effect! Lame!)

Sadly, online games don\'t work with it, but watching enormous streams of turbolasers flying out of my ships instead of piddly half-assed rivlets, that pulverise fighters in their way for once, and corvettes that are no longer the ultimate \"beat anything\" ship (Mandalorian Corvette, here\'s lookin\' at you... that thing is so damned good!), or the ultimate \"1 beats 1,000 fighters\" ship.

I wish the AI would use the pop cap more appropriately with mon-cals and whatnot instead of fighters and corvettes... my fleet of 40 victories has nothing fun to fight


/{[[===============================,
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Do not ask for whom the bell tolls, it tolls for thee...
posted 01-29-07 08:56 PM EDT (US)     29 / 238  
And with that i thoguht i would never play against you with my Fighter Fleets when you have those ships

May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr
posted 01-29-07 11:00 PM EDT (US)     30 / 238  
That would be fun using those mods, I think. I am curious about how you balanced it, though. Obviously realism is something to strive for, but balance is also just as important, if not much more.

"It seems to me the humour of Sails is so dry you could strike a match on it and it would be the humour that caught fire." - Friend of Old
posted 01-31-07 05:25 PM EDT (US)     31 / 238  
Yeah, Mandolarian Corvettes??

May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr
posted 02-01-07 01:55 AM EDT (US)     32 / 238  
Boba Fett... He means Boba laying a bomb in the middle of a huge fight. Its very OP because even if enemies see it get layed down, most of the time they won't be able to escape. You may save a squadron or two if you anticipate it (which isn't actually to hard) but then if you move your ships away when the bomb isn't layed, the enemy fighters get potshots at your fleet of fastly fleeing fighters.

PS: I know fastly isn't a word but go with it and read the sentence aloud


"It seems to me the humour of Sails is so dry you could strike a match on it and it would be the humour that caught fire." - Friend of Old
posted 02-01-07 10:18 AM EDT (US)     33 / 238  
Of course

May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr
posted 02-01-07 08:00 PM EDT (US)     34 / 238  
Well if you are using rebels this is another great fleet compostion:
-3 MonCal cruisers
-4 Corellian Corvettes
-1 Assault Frigate MK.II
-1 Marauder
-1 fleet commander

NO FIGHTERS OR BOMBERS, they take up you reinforcement points and do not provide the firepower you need! The Corvettes will take care of any enemy fighters/bombers and the Marauder can handle the station, just protect it.

posted 02-01-07 10:18 PM EDT (US)     35 / 238  
Its true that fighters aren't really needed but they can be useful on occasion. The bombers are always useful though. If you just get rid of the station shield hardpoint it is more than worth it. Then use them to bomb shields of ISD's or Victories. By then they will be gone and you can hyper in another ship or two. They only last a little while so the reinforcement points aren't an issue.

"It seems to me the humour of Sails is so dry you could strike a match on it and it would be the humour that caught fire." - Friend of Old
posted 02-02-07 04:32 PM EDT (US)     36 / 238  
yes, i agree bomber do die fairly quickley and therefore won't take up much for reinforcement points, however the Marauder(s) do the same job from much longer ranges and if it survives you didn't lose any credits on the bombers
posted 02-02-07 04:34 PM EDT (US)     37 / 238  
I really dont feel like explaining the Fighter Fleet tactic again. I have used this in every kind of scenario or battle u can imagine it and it always succesful.

Imagine taking out two ISD's and the Tyranny with only a level 2 Space Station and the Millenium Falcon.


May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr
posted 02-02-07 06:05 PM EDT (US)     38 / 238  
I imagine you're talking about against the AI, because a Human Player will eat your fleet alive.

For that matter, if the AI is smart enough (or the game is early enough) to use 4-6 Tartans, you're dead as well.


"we have an agenda, a character assassination agenda, assassinating characters is what we do for a living" - Sukkit
posted 02-02-07 06:25 PM EDT (US)     39 / 238  
Jesus we have been over this already!!!!!!!! You guys don't read at all do you. That's why we throw in the Corellian Gunships. Or early in the games Neb B's or Corellian Corvettes.

May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr

[This message has been edited by DeadlyRifle (edited 02-02-2007 @ 06:27 PM).]

posted 02-02-07 11:45 PM EDT (US)     40 / 238  
As for organization of the fleet (I haven't tried this but it doesn't need testing) just hyper in only one X-wing squad and have X foils locked to speed. Scout ahead before you go, and if you find tartans only hyper in the corvettes to deal with the tartans as much as possible. THEN bring in the fighters. Most people think its necessary to have your whole fleet hypered in and to move it to position, but thats just stupid. Bring the bombers in behind the enemy fighter screen and have Han and the X wings own the fighters will the bombers destroy vital hard points. Sure there are SOME weaknesses to the strategy, but all strategies do or there would be no point in even playing.

"It seems to me the humour of Sails is so dry you could strike a match on it and it would be the humour that caught fire." - Friend of Old
posted 02-03-07 01:58 AM EDT (US)     41 / 238  

Quote:

Jesus we have been over this already!!!!!!!! You guys don't read at all do you. That's why we throw in the Corellian Gunships. Or early in the games Neb B's or Corellian Corvettes.

Fighter Fleet =/= /GunshipsCorvettes/Neb B's.

I read quite fine. You said "fighter fleet". That implies a lack of corvette/capship.


"we have an agenda, a character assassination agenda, assassinating characters is what we do for a living" - Sukkit
posted 02-03-07 10:22 AM EDT (US)     42 / 238  
No, its just simpler to type and the majority of the work would be done by fighters so its called a fighter fleet.

"It seems to me the humour of Sails is so dry you could strike a match on it and it would be the humour that caught fire." - Friend of Old
posted 02-03-07 10:38 AM EDT (US)     43 / 238  
Sure, i have even come up with counter to the Fighter Fleet when playing as the empire. The principal of the matter is what GoSailing said. The fighters do all of the work with the Gunships/Corvettes providing support or additional firepower when neccesary. It isnt one of thos set back and watch battles, it is a intense tactic.

May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr
posted 02-03-07 01:04 PM EDT (US)     44 / 238  
I'm going to guess that it's something along the lines of a lot of tartans, a couple broadside cruisers, and a couple acclamators?


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posted 02-03-07 01:49 PM EDT (US)     45 / 238  
Not at all, those would get blown away buy a fighter fleet espeacially the Acclamators and Broadsides, the Tartans not so much.

May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr
posted 02-04-07 02:19 AM EDT (US)     46 / 238  
Properly managed Broadsides would be unlikely to be "blown away", so long as they have a defending screen of CapShips.

Sure, the Vettes/Gunships might be able to speed boost in, destroy, and maybe speed boost out, but then you're losing your tactical support, and likely the Broadsides have already done a hell of a lot damage to your fighters.

Now, if you already KNOW what the enemy has, and send only the Vettes/Gunships in first, I can see the Broadsides being negated, but at the cost of your smaller ships as well. I suppose that's worth it, if you can be sure to beat the Imp fighters.


"we have an agenda, a character assassination agenda, assassinating characters is what we do for a living" - Sukkit

[This message has been edited by Stormraider (edited 02-04-2007 @ 02:20 AM).]

posted 02-04-07 10:34 AM EDT (US)     47 / 238  
A broadside wouldn't be able to even hit your fighters if you just keep them spread out a bit. The missles are to inacurate to hit individual fighters. If you kept your fighters in a giant mob, then yes they could get slaughtered pretty easily but as Rifle has said and common sense would dictate, a Fighter Fleet requires lots of micro and thought. Thats one of the things that appeals to me about it, as this game is rather simple (no offense, there is nothing wrong with that).

"It seems to me the humour of Sails is so dry you could strike a match on it and it would be the humour that caught fire." - Friend of Old
posted 02-04-07 11:56 AM EDT (US)     48 / 238  
Its like GoSailing is reading my mind here. He is absolutley right.


Stormraider, say for instance that I'm playing a game, my Fighter Fleet against the fleet that Watchwood descirbed for us. The first thing that I would do is send three of my 5-6 Y-Wing squadrons, guarded by an A-Wing Squadron out into a good hiding place. I would then engage the CapShips that you said would screen your Broadsides. Your CapShips would be engaged trying to shoot at tiny tiny fighters that are dismantling your ships hardpoint by hardpoint. And out since i no where everything is on the battlefield thanks to my tiny fast fighters that are beating the crap outta your CapShips, I decide to get rid of your Broadsides that are attacking my Spacestation( or a target of your choosing, it doesn't really matter). My three Y-Wing squadrons and A-Wing Squadron come out of hiding and procede to take out the shields with Ion Cannon shots and then to blow them to hell with proton torpedos. I then send a Correlian Gunship to cover them and add some more firepower, or to hit your limping CapShips from behind.


May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr

[This message has been edited by DeadlyRifle (edited 02-04-2007 @ 12:05 PM).]

posted 02-04-07 12:14 PM EDT (US)     49 / 238  
Plans are all well and good, but, as with reality, in a game they rarely last past the first skirmish. Take, for example, your plan:

Quote:

I would then engage the CapShips that you said would screen your Broadsides. Your CapShips would be engaged trying to shoot at tiny tiny fighters that are dismantling your ships hardpoint by hardpoint.

No, my CapShips would be busy targetting your corvettes/gunships, while the "lot of Tartans" that Watchwood describes massacre your fighters, which as you described, are attacking my CapShips.

Quote:

My three Y-Wing squadrons and A-Wing Squadron come out of hiding and procede to take out the shields with Ion Cannon shots and then to blow them to hell with proton torpedos.

Your squadrons come out of hiding, and run right into the remaining Tartans which are NOT engaging your initial force, because unless I'm an idiot, I have to assume that your fighters will at some point attempt to slip past my screen and target the Broadsides, which are slowly decimating your fighters as they attempt to flee the Tartans. The Broadsides can do this because, as you seem to have failed to notice, they do not HAVE to hit individual fighters--the missiles have proximity sensors, and their explosions have a range more than capable of hitting fighters nearby.

Quote:

I then send a Correlian Gunship to cover them and add some more firepower, or to hit your limping CapShips from behind.

The gunships which are currently being blown to pieces by the relatively undamaged CapShips, due to the Tartan and Broadside screen covering them quite adequately from fighters.


So, as you can see, the "plan" can always easily be countered, even without any knowledge of what you're attempting on my part. The game will always go to skill, or to luck. No "plan" is likely to succeed past the initial stage, unless your opponent is an idiot.

Now, likely you'll be micromanaging your fighters to avoid the Tartans and Broadsides, and likely I'll eventually lose those Broadsides to Vettes/Gunships. However, those same gunships will be decimated by my CapShips, leaving your fighters to dance around attempting to hit weak points, which maybe they will; but likely that fleet is going to fall regardless.


"we have an agenda, a character assassination agenda, assassinating characters is what we do for a living" - Sukkit
posted 02-04-07 12:27 PM EDT (US)     50 / 238  
Awesome finally someone is offering counter-points to my strategies.


Ok after all that is left are my fighters and your CapShips, this becomes the easy part. All Captial Ships for the Empire, have the blind spot behind their engines. In addition its like in land battles, Turbo-laser batteries have a very difficult time taking out infanrty. The same applies in space. A large turbolaser battery is not able to target small, fast fighters. By now your CapShips have lost at least one hardpoint probably the hanger, cause i go for that. Now assuming at least two squadrons of any type of fighter have been lost, that is still a large amount of fighters attacking Capital Ships that have no fighters to protect them or the targeting abilities to effcitvley decimate one of these squadrons.

This is where improvsing comes in as Stormraider said. All strategies have counter-strategies. Plans almost never go the right way, the planners of D-Day new this after H-hour. So what makes us, a bunch of kids/teenagers (at least i am), with out any military training (that i no of) any different? Improvising is the single most important tactic you can have.


May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't.
- General George Patton Jr

[This message has been edited by DeadlyRifle (edited 02-04-2007 @ 12:37 PM).]

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